Advertisement
Has anyone been to Konya? Is it really as conservative and proper as Lonely Planet says, and do women really get harassed more than elsewhere in Turkey, the way it is described in there?
I would love to see Rumi's grave but could do without all that aggravation. Could you describe your impressions if youb have been there, pleasde?
I would love to see Rumi's grave but could do without all that aggravation. Could you describe your impressions if youb have been there, pleasde?
posted by:
|
Japan
|
Advertisement
Advertisement
-
Re: Konya
Wed, July 29, 2009 - 11:20 AMyes it is very conservative. best way to deal with that is to dress on the conservative side and don't walk around like a western tourist (i think you know what i mean), make eye contact or get into any conversations, etc. with people on the street. go where you are going and keep it at that. but again, thousands of tourists go there, its not a problem. in 2001 my girlfriend was tutted at a lot but that was it. i hear don't go out after dark but don't know about that. it's not a very attractive place anyway, see the sufi stuff in a few hours and that's about it. -
-
Re: Konya
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 1:07 PMOh, hell, I get tutted at for wearing below-the-knee shorts in Taksim. A little tutt never hurt a girl.
BTW, are you blonde? That makes things just a little more difficult sometimes. -
-
Re: Konya
Sun, August 2, 2009 - 6:06 PMNo, I am brunette, and got mistaken for a Turk sometimes, when walking down Istiklal last time in Istanbul, and that made my life infinitely easier. (!) The only way to get some respect there, I guess. And I was wearing a long gypsy skirt and a tank top, with a bit of skin showing in between skirt and top. And long open hair. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 1:20 AM"The only way to get some respect there, I guess."
like the only way to get a german to like you is by eating a bratwurst?
i hope you're joking. i am. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 4:54 AMBelieve me, I have a colleague who can't even rent an apartment in some buildings because she's blonde. A lot of people here assume all blondes are prostitutes. No joke. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 6:26 AMof course, prejudice is no joke anywhere.
as it is also not a joke that the only way you get respect in turkey is by being brunette. this kind of statement does nothing to help anyone. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 7:06 AMYou have never been a woman in Turkey, David, much less a lone one. So don't speak for others. And having dark hair is not all there is to it. My friend who has lived there for 10 years can spot a tourist in a room from 5m away by their attitude. Anyway, being a non-Muslim already puts you in a different category, and that is a fact.
and FYI, bratwurst is not where it's at in Germany. We live on doner kebab, baguette and caprese these days.
Having said all that, I get along great with many of the Turks and Kurds, getting true respect or not notwithstanding. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 8:30 AMAll of this talk about "Turks" seems extremely generalized and simplistic and, as David seems to be saying, more rooted in prejudice and stereotypes than fact. Turks can be of almost any original ethnic background ... Turkic, Slavic, Arabic, Greek, Armenian, Kurdish, Roma, Albanian, Romanian, Vlach, African, Mongol ... So, what exactly does a "Turk" look like? I have met many fair-skinned, blonde Turkish people. What did Ataturk say? Whoever lives in Turkey, speaks Turkish and claims to be a Turk IS a Turk, something like that?
As for Turkish people's famous ability at picking out tourists in crowds ... Hmmmm, both times I've been to Turkey, people asked me if I was Turkish, if I was a Bosniak (Bosnian Muslim), a Bulgarian, a Pomak (Bulgarian Muslim) and Albanian. Feel free to look at the photos of myself in my Tribe profile ... Do I look like a Turk? Maybe a Turkicized Slav or Albanian, I dunno.
Sure, attitude has a LOT to do with it. When my wife and I travel, we tend to maintain a fairly low profile. We try to keep our eyes, ears and hearts open and our mouths shut ... But we've all definitely seen other tourists who think that it's all about them ... loud, rude, self-absorbed, glaring at strangers full in the face and almost intentionally drawing attention to themselves and their obnoxious self-delusion that everything they see is somehow being "discovered" by them for the first time.
My wife was hassled one time in Turkey, in a rural town in a conservative area ... a woman actually spit at her, or in her general direction ... We had been hiking in some nearby hills, and my wife was wearing a pair of shorts that stopped somewhere around her neck.
Overall, I have a feeling that it all has to do more with how you carry yourself in a crowd than with the color of your hair or even your dress or religion.
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 8:31 AMi would like to just respectfully point out a few things astrid,
- i never spoke for anyone except myself.
- my sex(or yours) has nothing to do with the subject i commented on.
- why does religion enter into it now?
- the number of turkish or kurdish friends and whether or not you enjoy them is also irrelevant.
- i simply found your comment to be a culturally misleading and potentially divisive remark. -
-
This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 8:35 AMWho is Astrid?
Canela Too Hot For You, my question for you is ...
When you travel abroad, do you bring that white Siberian tiger with you? I would be inclined to believe that a foreign girl can wear any damn thing she wants when she strolls around with a big white Siberian tiger. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 8:56 AMThis discussion is getting messier by the minute, and I feel rather uncertain whether it is gonna do any good trying to sort it out.
a)I did not say that people mistook me for a Turk becauise of my hair
b) my friend in Istanbul who can spot tourists from a distance is not a Turk. He lives there. And what he can spot is the difference between a new arrival and a foreign resident of Turkey.
c) David commented on my posting, saying what I said about my experience is not helpful. "Gender has nothing to do with it" how you get treated in Turkey is simply not true.
d) "enjoying my Turkish and Kurdish friends" , as David put it, seems to have a derogatory undertone which I do not appreciate.
e) Yes, I bring my tiger with me when I go to turkey. I need him. I also need him just to talk to you here, it seems. I have a lot less problems making myself understood in Turkey than with you here.
f) What's the point? I am no longer sure what David's point is. What I feel he is trying to say is, that I have no right to share my experiences in Turkey in this forum as they are somehow irrelevant compared to his. Just a hunch. Fact is that I got treated like a normal person once people thought I was Turkish, and I found that very pleasant and relaxing compared to before.
g) Astrid is me, Geoff. You have always chosen to talk over my head to David in this forum when I posted before but maybe you noticed i was there, sometimes.
h) I feel tired. Turkey is a lot more fun than this stuff. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 9:07 AMAs far as being "hastled" in rural areas is concerned- Turks have rarely openly hastled me unless they wanted to sell me a carpet or something, the harassment occurs on a different level, covered up by charme and friendly interest. I have however, one very unpleasant memory which is when my tour bus stopped in some village between Fethiye and Hierapolis, and I had food poisoning after eating some yoghurt in a highway restaurant. I was feeling terrible, had cramps in my gut, had a fever and stumbled down the street and sat down at the first chair I could find on the roadside and bent over in pain. After a while a woman clad in black showed up and started talking to me in some urgent tone. I did not understand a word, and assumed, she wanted me to get off that chair. Then a friend came who knew a little Turkish and she transalted what the woman said:" When you sit doubled over like that, there is some skin showing at your back between your t-shirt and your skirt. Please cover yourself." I groaned:"Oh, Gawd!" when I heard that, and told my friend to tell her I was very sick. "Then you should get up and find a doctor", she said cooly and walked away.
But this is really the only really bad memory I have, apart from the scary stuff like spiked drinks and so on.
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 9:09 AMi have no idea what you are talking about astrid... never mind.
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 10:18 AMAstrid, as we sometimes say in this part of the country, you are one hot little mess. If you are as hypersensitive, thin-skinned, needlessly unpleasant and self-important when you travel as you have been during this discussion, you will definitely have a lot of problems in Turkey ... or anywhere, for that matter. I mean, good gawd, Tiger Lady, item g) in your list of woe is just downright weird ... Have we even MET before? When in the heck have I ever "talked over [your] head" (let alone "always")? You seem to have some longstanding problem with me despite the fact that I have no idea who you even are! Maybe I'm persecuting you because of your gender ... or your religion ... or your hair color ... or your tiger ... Have a good trip, whacko ... Go to Turkey thinking the worst of everyone, and then tell us ALL about how poorly you were treated when you come home, how about that? -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 4:04 PMNow I am glad you never talked to me before, Geoff. I did not know you were this nasty and insensitive. And as I said before, I never have trouble communicating with the Turks, they do not make it difficult the way you do. I am not going to ask about your motives for that. -
-
Re: Konya
Mon, August 3, 2009 - 6:01 PMMy "motives"? Laying it on a bit thick, don't you think? I imagine the whole world seems nasty and insensitive to you, doesn't it, Canela Too Hot For You? Maybe that's why you're posting these insipid discussions that say, essentially, "Hello, I am going to Turkey, will they be nasty and insensitive to me?" Seriously, have a safe trip. See if you can maybe even enjoy yourself a little bit while you're there.
I am done with you and your psychodrama.
İyi yolculuklar! Güle, güle!
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
-
